I'm running version 3.28.2.0 on a mid-2012 MacBook Pro with MacOS Sierra 10.12.6
Currently, I'm working on a fairly complex drawing of a building, with plans and elevations all on the same page (document).
Everything seemed to work fine until I noticed a couple of days ago that after working on the details of an elevation, out of nowhere QCAD had copied about 75% of the entities of the plan and moved and pasted them on top of what I had drawn originally.
Of some elements it only took a few entities, others it copied and moved completely.
Then late last night, after working again for hours on details of an elevation, I decided to finish for the day and hit "Save" again, as I do regularly.
I zoomed out to see everything, and to my horror, I noticed that QCAD had somehow deleted about 90% of the plan, again most everything completely but of some elements only certain entities, and always the same entities of identical elements.
Of course since I had just saved it, I could not revert to the previously saved.
I tried quitting QCAD and starting again, thinking that it might just be a glitch of not displaying everything, but nothing changed and it looks like I just lost days of work!
I searched this forum for others experiencing similar issues, and I found some posts of disappearing entities, but nothing conclusive.
Of course now I'm reluctant to do any further work on QCAD, and I'm certainly pretty frustrated that this €40 software suddenly turned into a €2000+ expense...
I do like the workflow and would love to continue using QCAD, so any help in resolving this is highly appreciated!
Disappearing Entities and Other Erratic Behavior
Moderator: andrew
Forum rules
Always indicate your operating system and QCAD version.
Attach drawing files and screenshots.
Post one question per topic.
Always indicate your operating system and QCAD version.
Attach drawing files and screenshots.
Post one question per topic.
Re: Disappearing Entities and Other Erratic Behavior
Hi, and welcome to the QCAD forum.
First, QCAD does not delete, invent or whatever on its own.
It executes commands on entities, draws new ones or delete entities as instructed.
Sorry to hear that you lost days of work.
A sound remedy is to have backups or save your work under a newer file name every now and then.
Certainly when working on complex, critical or 'heavy' drawings.
You can't blame QCAD ... "The program is provided AS IS with NO WARRANTY OF ANY KIND ... "
Read further under Help .. About.
For the rest we can only guess without an example file.
- Are all entities 2D? Have you flatten the drawing to 2D?
- Is geometry stored in blocks? Have you imported or overwritten the block content?
- Have you verified what or how many things were selected before hitting the Delete key?
(A worn down mouse button may do or select odd things. An unintended double click may select all connected)
- How large is your file or how many entities are in there?
- ...
- ..
- .
Bottom line: There is usually another reason than just QCAD.
Regards,
CVH
First, QCAD does not delete, invent or whatever on its own.
It executes commands on entities, draws new ones or delete entities as instructed.
Sorry to hear that you lost days of work.
A sound remedy is to have backups or save your work under a newer file name every now and then.
Certainly when working on complex, critical or 'heavy' drawings.
You can't blame QCAD ... "The program is provided AS IS with NO WARRANTY OF ANY KIND ... "
Read further under Help .. About.
For the rest we can only guess without an example file.
- Are all entities 2D? Have you flatten the drawing to 2D?
- Is geometry stored in blocks? Have you imported or overwritten the block content?
- Have you verified what or how many things were selected before hitting the Delete key?
(A worn down mouse button may do or select odd things. An unintended double click may select all connected)
- How large is your file or how many entities are in there?
- ...
- ..
- .
Bottom line: There is usually another reason than just QCAD.
Regards,
CVH
Re: Disappearing Entities and Other Erratic Behavior
Thank you for the welcome, and thank you for replying, CVH!
First off, my apologies, I didn't mean to imply that QCAD or anyone affiliated with it should be liable for this, nor that all of a sudden QCAD took over!
But as a newbie to QCAD, and CAD, who else could I blame;? After all, my computer is not even a teenager yet, my cat was sleeping when the glitch happened, and I of course never caused QCAD to move or delete anything
On a serious note again, I know that regular and constant backups are a solution to such instances, and luckily I did have time machine running and later today discovered that it had created a backup last night, shortly before the hiccup, so between this and the file post glitch, almost everything should still be there..
Until now, I never had to use time machine though, and I sometimes work on other intensive software, hence the quick "blame" on QCAD.
In any case, I did start the drawing from someone else's .dwg document that I imported, then proceeded to copy, modify, delete and draw entities in as necessary, without knowing what exactly that document contained (nor having read much of the QCAD book) but also not noticing any blocks.
And now that I have read your reply and also read the Block chapter in the book, I see that somehow things could still have gotten a bit tangled somewhere, but I have no clue where and how that could have been...
Maybe I should just start again, creating everything from scratch, so I know what's in it and how it all connects?
I don't want to waste your time further, but if you want to look at the files of before (with date-time in title) and after the "disaster" (with "CORRUPTED" in title), they're attached.
Thanks again!
ako
First off, my apologies, I didn't mean to imply that QCAD or anyone affiliated with it should be liable for this, nor that all of a sudden QCAD took over!
But as a newbie to QCAD, and CAD, who else could I blame;? After all, my computer is not even a teenager yet, my cat was sleeping when the glitch happened, and I of course never caused QCAD to move or delete anything
On a serious note again, I know that regular and constant backups are a solution to such instances, and luckily I did have time machine running and later today discovered that it had created a backup last night, shortly before the hiccup, so between this and the file post glitch, almost everything should still be there..
Until now, I never had to use time machine though, and I sometimes work on other intensive software, hence the quick "blame" on QCAD.
In any case, I did start the drawing from someone else's .dwg document that I imported, then proceeded to copy, modify, delete and draw entities in as necessary, without knowing what exactly that document contained (nor having read much of the QCAD book) but also not noticing any blocks.
And now that I have read your reply and also read the Block chapter in the book, I see that somehow things could still have gotten a bit tangled somewhere, but I have no clue where and how that could have been...
Maybe I should just start again, creating everything from scratch, so I know what's in it and how it all connects?
I don't want to waste your time further, but if you want to look at the files of before (with date-time in title) and after the "disaster" (with "CORRUPTED" in title), they're attached.
Thanks again!
ako
- Attachments
-
- CORRUPTED_PlansAndElevations_QCAD.dxf
- (491.92 KiB) Downloaded 70 times
-
- 20240118-132430_PlansAndElevations_QCAD.dxf
- (529.69 KiB) Downloaded 76 times
Re: Disappearing Entities and Other Erratic Behavior
Please have a look at a new mouse ... 14€ - 400€ and more doesn't really matter.
With one double click near a polyline on layer "WALL" and Delete I can basically replicate the corrupted file from the other.
When zoomed in on a detail you won't be aware that with an unintended double-click you selected 450 entities.
Only a look at the Property Editor may tell you that.
Mouse button behavior can be tweaked a bit to avoid such double glitches by the OS mouse settings.
But that is a race you won't win.
Under Application Preferences .. Behaviour .. Double-Click one could un-check selecting contours.
But being able to select a so called contour in this way is a bonus.
Replacing the mouse is the best option in the end.
I am using my fourth (cheap) mouse at the moment ... ... It is always the left button that starts to fail first.
Also note that the Undo feature is about limitless in the current instance.
Further remark that there are 5 duplicate entities in the drawing and 24 null-length polylines.
Regards,
CVH
With one double click near a polyline on layer "WALL" and Delete I can basically replicate the corrupted file from the other.
When zoomed in on a detail you won't be aware that with an unintended double-click you selected 450 entities.
Only a look at the Property Editor may tell you that.
Mouse button behavior can be tweaked a bit to avoid such double glitches by the OS mouse settings.
But that is a race you won't win.
Under Application Preferences .. Behaviour .. Double-Click one could un-check selecting contours.
But being able to select a so called contour in this way is a bonus.
Replacing the mouse is the best option in the end.
I am using my fourth (cheap) mouse at the moment ...
... It is always the left button that starts to fail first.Also note that the Undo feature is about limitless in the current instance.
Further remark that there are 5 duplicate entities in the drawing and 24 null-length polylines.
Regards,
CVH
Re: Disappearing Entities and Other Erratic Behavior
I really appreciate you taking the time to look into this deeper!
I was using the MacBook's trackpad, which has shown a few signs of erratic behavior (not as much as my own fingers...), so I just got me an actual mouse (USB, since I trust that more than wireless).
But I'll still try to tweak and stick to the trackpad for now, since it's the nearest to the built-in keyboard.
Once I get more experienced with QCAD, I'll set up my drawing tablet with my most often used commands.
That should make working in it easier.
I also replicated the double-click on my end to see what happened, and yes, everything that disappeared was part of that selection.
And the other night, I was indeed selecting and deleting auxiliary and other lines. (I'll eat some more humble soup for dinner tonight...)
I will turn off that double-click for now, since one of my fingers might override even a perfectly functioning mouse button at any time
A couple of things aren't exactly clear to me though:
Does QCAD connect all touching entities as a contour, and select all of these when one is double-clicked, no matter which layer these entities are on, as long as their respective layer is not hidden?
Or does QCAD only connect entities when they share a reference point; so that if I moved/placed an entity with coordinates or keyboard arrows instead of using reference points, those entities wouldn't be connected, even if their reference points share the same exact location?
I'm asking because in my drawing, not all entities are selected on a double click, even though they could (visually) be considered part of a contour.
I also created blocks within blocks, will that throw things off?
When I built the doors, I created blocks of frame members, threshold and actual door, then enclosed those in one block.
With doors of different sizes, I first simply exploded the original one, exploded and adjusted all sub blocks that needed adjustment, and then created blocks of these again, overwriting (using the same name of) the previously created respective block.
After a while, I realized that I should probably create separate blocks (and sub-blocks) for individual door sizes (Read The Manual!)
And yes, while reading the chapter yesterday, I learned that blocks behave differently than groups.
So coming back to the door example, for a door that is narrower, but the same height as another, I need to make specific sub-blocks for threshold, frame top piece and of course the door itself.
But can I "reuse" the frame side piece sub-block from that other wider door, and thus also make it a part of the specific main block for that whole narrow-door-assembly?
I hope you understand what I'm trying to get at.
From now on, instead of panicking and blaming when something happens unexpectedly, I'll retrace my last steps, and do more reading of the book.
One last question, where or how can I see the info on duplicate entities and null-length polylines?
Many thanks again, and a great weekend to you!
I was using the MacBook's trackpad, which has shown a few signs of erratic behavior (not as much as my own fingers...), so I just got me an actual mouse (USB, since I trust that more than wireless).
But I'll still try to tweak and stick to the trackpad for now, since it's the nearest to the built-in keyboard.
Once I get more experienced with QCAD, I'll set up my drawing tablet with my most often used commands.
That should make working in it easier.
I also replicated the double-click on my end to see what happened, and yes, everything that disappeared was part of that selection.
And the other night, I was indeed selecting and deleting auxiliary and other lines. (I'll eat some more humble soup for dinner tonight...)
I will turn off that double-click for now, since one of my fingers might override even a perfectly functioning mouse button at any time
A couple of things aren't exactly clear to me though:
Does QCAD connect all touching entities as a contour, and select all of these when one is double-clicked, no matter which layer these entities are on, as long as their respective layer is not hidden?
Or does QCAD only connect entities when they share a reference point; so that if I moved/placed an entity with coordinates or keyboard arrows instead of using reference points, those entities wouldn't be connected, even if their reference points share the same exact location?
I'm asking because in my drawing, not all entities are selected on a double click, even though they could (visually) be considered part of a contour.
I also created blocks within blocks, will that throw things off?
When I built the doors, I created blocks of frame members, threshold and actual door, then enclosed those in one block.
With doors of different sizes, I first simply exploded the original one, exploded and adjusted all sub blocks that needed adjustment, and then created blocks of these again, overwriting (using the same name of) the previously created respective block.
After a while, I realized that I should probably create separate blocks (and sub-blocks) for individual door sizes (Read The Manual!)
And yes, while reading the chapter yesterday, I learned that blocks behave differently than groups.
So coming back to the door example, for a door that is narrower, but the same height as another, I need to make specific sub-blocks for threshold, frame top piece and of course the door itself.
But can I "reuse" the frame side piece sub-block from that other wider door, and thus also make it a part of the specific main block for that whole narrow-door-assembly?
I hope you understand what I'm trying to get at.
From now on, instead of panicking and blaming when something happens unexpectedly, I'll retrace my last steps, and do more reading of the book.
One last question, where or how can I see the info on duplicate entities and null-length polylines?
Many thanks again, and a great weekend to you!
Re: Disappearing Entities and Other Erratic Behavior
A trackpad, I see ... Did not come up with that for the simple reason that touch devices don't work for me.
I am excluded from using the bank terminal, the new parking meters, the grosery scale, ... or those (not so) smart-phones ...
Trackpads are much harder to replace ... For fingers that is practically impossible.
I start to need some spare parts myself.
As pointed out, contour selecting is in fact all connected at endpoints.
(There are more kinds of references than only the endpoints, most types of entities have 2 endings)
If that is clearly defined and singular then it will select a closed contour.
And indeed, you can customize this with hiding, freezing, or locking layers, which essentially controls the selectable nature.
The double-click method has no configurable options.
Menu Select .. (De-) Select Contour (TC) tool has option on the Options Toolbar for connecting tolerance and/or for the same layer.
This is to keep the forum searchable.
Blocks in Blocks is not really an issue but the general advice is to not overdo the stacked nature.
At some point it won't make sense or be clear even to you. Attribute inheritance can become an unsolvable mystery.
Yes, one can chop up 'doors' in sub parts and reuse the parts for defining different 'doors', double 'doors', ...
A Block Reference can be reused at scale, what includes flipping, mirroring.
But simply said, don't over-complicate things for yourself.
In CAD the usage of Blocks is intended to group geometry that belongs together, the entities can live on different layers.
Only remind that there is a major difference between a Block definition (a collection of) and a Block Reference (a single entity).
A different method of Groups is not supported.
These tools make a selection and remark that like many tools they stay active until terminated.
Both tools have configurable options, most QCAD tool options are stored persistent between usage.
Only ... A right-click is not implemented for 'Done' or 'Cancel' ...
On could deleted all detected in one go and terminate (Eraser icon) or close the tool (Cross icon) what keeps the current selection.
I can only advice that you ensure yourself that it are the correct entities that are marked for deletion with MD.
Regards,
CVH
I am excluded from using the bank terminal, the new parking meters, the grosery scale, ... or those (not so) smart-phones ...
Trackpads are much harder to replace ... For fingers that is practically impossible.
I start to need some spare parts myself.
As pointed out, contour selecting is in fact all connected at endpoints.
(There are more kinds of references than only the endpoints, most types of entities have 2 endings)
If that is clearly defined and singular then it will select a closed contour.
And indeed, you can customize this with hiding, freezing, or locking layers, which essentially controls the selectable nature.
The double-click method has no configurable options.
Menu Select .. (De-) Select Contour (TC) tool has option on the Options Toolbar for connecting tolerance and/or for the same layer.
In this forum it is common that you post one question per topic, see forum rules in red at the top.
This is to keep the forum searchable.
Blocks in Blocks is not really an issue but the general advice is to not overdo the stacked nature.
At some point it won't make sense or be clear even to you. Attribute inheritance can become an unsolvable mystery.
Yes, one can chop up 'doors' in sub parts and reuse the parts for defining different 'doors', double 'doors', ...
A Block Reference can be reused at scale, what includes flipping, mirroring.
But simply said, don't over-complicate things for yourself.
In CAD the usage of Blocks is intended to group geometry that belongs together, the entities can live on different layers.
Only remind that there is a major difference between a Block definition (a collection of) and a Block Reference (a single entity).
A different method of Groups is not supported.
See menu Modify .. Detection (MD for (nearly) duplicates, MZ for (nearly) zeros)
These tools make a selection and remark that like many tools they stay active until terminated.
Both tools have configurable options, most QCAD tool options are stored persistent between usage.
Only ... A right-click is not implemented for 'Done' or 'Cancel' ...
On could deleted all detected in one go and terminate (Eraser icon) or close the tool (Cross icon) what keeps the current selection.
I can only advice that you ensure yourself that it are the correct entities that are marked for deletion with MD.
Regards,
CVH
Re: Disappearing Entities and Other Erratic Behavior
A thousand thanks again for all your elaborate answers and for your patience in dealing with my ignorance, CVH!!
And I'm looking forward to getting more proficient with QCAD and learning all its features!
As mentioned in my original post, I definitely like the workflow of it, and now that you taught me some of its characteristics, I feel very enthusiastic about continuing working with it, and of course I'm super happy to have found such amazing software at this incredible price!
Not sure if you are the creator (or one of the creators), but I'm certainly extremely grateful for your extensive knowledge of QCAD, and your prompt responses to my questions!
I hope you're enjoying a wonderful Sunday)
And I'm looking forward to getting more proficient with QCAD and learning all its features!
As mentioned in my original post, I definitely like the workflow of it, and now that you taught me some of its characteristics, I feel very enthusiastic about continuing working with it, and of course I'm super happy to have found such amazing software at this incredible price!
Not sure if you are the creator (or one of the creators), but I'm certainly extremely grateful for your extensive knowledge of QCAD, and your prompt responses to my questions!
I hope you're enjoying a wonderful Sunday
)Re: Disappearing Entities and Other Erratic Behavior
Thanks for the kind words.
I am simply a user but I write/design my own QCAD tools and know a little of the inside of QCAD.
Regards,
CVH
I am simply a user but I write/design my own QCAD tools and know a little of the inside of QCAD.
Regards,
CVH